A free fan-made modification for Age of Empires III

 
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Jutlander
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WoL civs discussion: Brazil!

Fri Aug 19, 2016 12:00 pm

So hey, welcome to our first post on WoL civilizations. With this we will try to bring discussion and inform new players about all the stuff this mod and its civilizations bring. We will, eventually, cover all WoL civilizations, so stay tuned, for this will get good.
Now, without further ado:


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Brazil

About the Civilization: Agrarian Boom
Brazil is an All-Around civilization with a focus on Villager economy (This means an economy lead by villagers, instead of automatic production, for instance). What makes them shine, then, is the fact that they have the tools to deal with pretty much everything, while still being able to boom, and with a particular edge because of its roster.
Their focus is Mills and Plantations, following the characteristics of most of rural Brazil during the 19th century, in where huge amounts of land were owned by a few that made a lot of money via slave work.
Their army, on the other side, is just full of surprises: A bunch of Unique Units that specialize in countering: Voluntario da Patria and Cassador Montado, and a unit roster that, with the Musketeer and the Aspide, makes for an insanely tough army to beat: Efficiency and Specialization, two elements that are not usually seen together.
So, usually, a boom is what you want to do, being it defensive or offensive, and it's not like you have much choice, since their rushes are not really that good when you consider the slaves bad hunting skills.
This is why this is a civilization that's so safe to pick. If you don't know what your enemy is playing, your expertise with the Brazilians will be your salvation: Voluntarios da Patria are a good choice against Fellahs or Impi rushes, and their safety allows them to outboom many civs, like the Colombians, if played right. Their only weakness might be defensive civs, but that mostly depends on skill and knowledge on the matchups.
In a way, Brazil's gratest enemy is the Slave Trade, their Big Button technology in the Town Center, that allows you to quickly get a bunch of Slaves, while the cost of the tech gets bigger every time. You will pretty soon find yourself paying much more than what the units are worth for your villagers, so plan ahead, and don't let them die, because they are expensive

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Historical discussion: Historical responsibility, and video-games.
It's actually been some fuss about the fact that we included slaves in the game, and with reason: Age of Empires III features european relations with natives in such a friendly way that it is embarrasing and, usually, this topics are not easy to handle. We get that. On the other hand, we have to be faithful to history, and this doesn't mean we have to create a simulator nor to stick to ''facts'' when making our games, but it means that we have a responsibility with the past and, therefore, with the present. In our opinion, to deny slavery and to present, in this case, a Brazilian empire without it would be censorship and a sad, sad revisionism. We can't deny slavery and we don't want you to play an idealized version of anything, even if it makes some people uncomfortable.
We would like to hear your opinions on the matter and any appreciation on this decision, if you have any.

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Balance: Fervor Voluntario and Slave Trade.
We nerfed Fervor Voluntario. Apparently people were too patriotic and eager to fight so we had to tone that down a little. Have you used Fervor Voluntario since? What is your opinion on Brazil in Industrial age right now?
Also, what is your opinion on Slave Trade? In one hand, it gives you a nice boost in the early game, but in the other hand, it gets impossible to keep up with it in the late game, being a major crippling factor. Would you change anything about it?

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Anyway, I hope you have liked this and don't hesitate on asking questions, suggesting or asking for new strategies and all of that. Here are some questions for you guys to discuss and try to answer:
How do I beat Brazil?
What civilization is Brazil greatest ally? Why?
Huehuehue or kkkkkk?
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UnstoppableStreletsy
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Re: WoL civs discussion: Brazil!

Fri Aug 26, 2016 8:44 pm

I like the new forum. Looks more modern.
So ya Brazil can be beaten in many ways.  The best way is to either rush extremely early, or build such great defenses that they cannot penetrate you early enough.
Since brazil's best defense from rushes is trash units, The best unit type to counter brazil's trash units , the pikeman, and the volturnio patra, is artillery. Ottomans, and latin civs therefore can defeat brazil quite early with grenadiers, abus guns, or aspides since pikemen and slaves cannot close the distance in time typically and volturnio's do not pack the ranged fire power even in numbers to counter artillery. Thats not to say that brazil cannot counter with its own aspides, but latin civs like paraguay and columbia who can age up with a aspide can take full advantage of this rush option. 

About turtling. Walls, towers, and goo artillery defenses can typically keep a early brazil army at bay since brazil in the early game rely's on infantry. In late game, the only options brazil has is to spam its good trash units such as royal guard pikemen and volturnios which come quickly from plantations with the ferver volturnio card even if it has been nerfed. Also brazil may send its unique ranged skirmisher, and royal guard muskets, so elite skirmisher units like those of the ethiopians, portuguese, paraguayans, and canadians can counter most of the brazilian unit roster except hussars, and artillery.

A good ally of brazil is ethiopia. Ethiopia has strong walls that hold out enemies and may stall a artillery rush if the brazil player builds close to his ally. Brazil can also help ethiopia build a advanced army earlier to protect them by tributing resources, of food and gold which slaves are good at gathering from buildings. While ethiopia fights the enemy army, brazil can use its trash units as cannon fodder for ranged units and can also push into enemy forests where villagers lie with volturnios.
 
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Pardal22
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Re: WoL civs discussion: Brazil!

Sat Aug 27, 2016 9:18 pm

First of all: Huehuehuehuehue.

Secondly:
"Also, what is your opinion on Slave Trade? In one hand, it gives you a nice boost in the early game, but in the other hand, it gets impossible to keep up with it in the late game, being a major crippling factor. Would you change anything about it?"

About the Slave Unit, it seems to me a bit strange to have it as an "stronger" settler. My opinion is that Brazil should have a normal settler (maybe call them 'Mulato' as the great majority of workers were in the early period [descendants os europeans and africans]) as europeans have and the "slave trade", as a mean of acquiring with coin, weaker workers (diminushed hp and attack, reflecting slaves reluctancy to fight and short life expectation).

Also we have the strange factor of abolition techs allowing more slaves to be trained. Maybe the abolition techs could be made in a way to "promote" the African Slave unit in a similar way the Danish can upgrade their settler. Considering that with the progress of pro-abolition politics, slave owners would seek to treat slaves in a more "serf" way in the farms (and house serveants and liberal profession slaves in the urban centers) form (couldn't think of a better way to express it in words) in order to keep the cheap labor force, the gradual substitution of the gang system to the task system is an example.
 So the techs could increase their hp and attack. This would give brazilian early economy a huge risk early on in the game, as a rush raid could quickly kill all of your slaves. This of course considering a way of having brazilian players chosing between an early settler boom with slave trade or a more secure and traditional european settler training.

That is indeed a complex question. As I have stated before, the 1875 census togheter with other documentation shows us that "only" 16% of brazil's black population was under slavery by the time of the Golden Law.
 
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CarlosParedes
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Re: WoL civs discussion: Brazil!

Tue Aug 30, 2016 1:09 am

That screenshots are so beautiful ♥ 
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Tahattus
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Re: WoL civs discussion: Brazil!

Tue Aug 30, 2016 2:55 am

Aren't they? We hope to keep illustrating the mod with such screenshots. Taken by Fenriz.
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Tahattus
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Image tahattus@gmail.com    Contact me: Image Image Brazil for the win! Image

"When are you gonna stop?" - Tilanus Commodor
"Definitely a fun and unique civ that we will never see anything close to in Napoleonic Era 2.21 for the next 40 to 59 years minimum right Tilanus?" - UnstoppableStreletsy
 
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Mandalore_Vlad
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Re: WoL civs discussion: Brazil!

Tue Aug 30, 2016 5:03 pm

How do I beat Brazil?
-Paraguay would say that, since its economy can handle alone thanks to their factories, besides that you can send troops nonstop against Brazil, would not let her or breathe if used properly

What civilization is Brazil greatest ally? Why?
-I would say that an ally that can defend as much as herself as Brazil, in this case Colombia would choose, this could defend itself by the bond of the guerrillas and create enough troops to protect Brazil during his boon
Es un gran sacrificio morir por tu pueblo, pero vivir por tu pueblo es un sacrificio aun mayor
 
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CelticCrusader
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Re: WoL civs discussion: Brazil!

Fri Sep 30, 2016 9:41 am

You say Brazil can't rush, I disagree, you can definitely do a nice timing before 10 mins. Voluntario train so fast that you can get a good mass out early. 
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TacoOfTheTuesday
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Re: WoL civs discussion: Brazil!

Wed Oct 05, 2016 12:22 am

Alright, here's the numbers.
After doing this test in a Skirmish match I discovered that a couple of Brazil's mechanics make it an extremely powerful pocket, sling civilization in large team games like 3v3 and 4v4, with the ability to economically support 1-2 other players. 
From what I have found, there are only these techs/Home City cards that increase the hitpoints of villagers: Theory of Evolution: Church, the Great Coat equivalent tech at the market, Corpo Fechado card, and the Pioneers card. These can be used before doing any Whip the Slaves to maximize the amount of times that it can be used.
Once all of these are researched, you can research Whip the Slaves a total of at least 93 times before the slaves' health falls before 0 and they die. I think that there should be a limit on how many times that this can be researched at a number sometime before this occurring. In conjunction with market techs, HC cards, and other economic improvements, the slaves have the potential to become a Courier Du Bois of sorts without the health and attack. 
Also, while doing this I found a bug where if you save the game and load it back up during a Skirmish, the slaves' maximum potential health is restored and therefore they can be healed by a physician or other healer, allowing for the Whip the Slaves tech to researched a practically infinite amount of times. I was able to research another 92+ times.

Now onto the Slave Trade, you can train all 99 of your slaves and still train this tech afterwards. Before the tech reached a price of almost 100,000 coin I was able to train it a total of 22 times and got another 110 slaves, meaning I ended up with 209 slaves. Obviously this tech gets extremely costly, but it is still possible to get this every once in a while after this due to the large number of slaves. 209 slaves with the post office villagers gives Brazil the potential of a super-economy unmatched by any other civilization.

I get that this is all hypothetical and is not exactly realistic to a game, but my main message is that there should be a limit to both the Whip the Slaves and Slave trade techs as allowing the player to destroy their own economy and go past the population limit with slaves should not be in the game.
Last edited by TacoOfTheTuesday on Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Jutlander
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Re: WoL civs discussion: Brazil!

Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:16 am

I believe that in a 4v4 Treaty 40 match, Brazil can be a bit unbalanced

That's the problem: Nobody cares about that.
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TacoOfTheTuesday
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Re: WoL civs discussion: Brazil!

Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:09 am

I believe that in a 4v4 Treaty 40 match, Brazil can be a bit unbalanced

Now that I think of it, that statement was really foolish. :)
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